What is one warning sign of a cult? Well, I think the most obvious is when a person is kept away from their loved-ones and all forms of communication are severed. That’s the most familiar one we all know about.
I want to call your attention to a blog called Sadparent’s Weblog. This lady is suffering through a very hurtful event in her life. Apparently, her son attends Mike Bickle’s International House of Prayer (IHOP), and as a result, he has been advised to break communication with his mother for at least a year. This is what Sadparent says:
I’ve lost a son to a thing called IHOP – he told me that “older and wiser council” had met with him. It was, therefore, his decision (after meeting with this ‘older and wiser council’) that he and I should have ZERO communication for “one year..at least”.
That’s the beginning of a great novel in the making. It’s also the sad, sad truth behind the last 2 years and 3 months of my life. The International House of “Prayer” (and unaccredited university) has been the catalyst in tearing a once loving relationship between mother and son in half. But that’s not what’s caused me to go into such deep mourning. (Online Source)
All the markers are there. The warning signs are beaming in all their brilliant resilience… and so many still can’t see them. This goes to show you truly can’t see when you’re blind.
continue here….
Wow! Not something a believer should be involved with!
I first heard about this group and the Kansas City Prophets a few years ago on a “hippie Christian bulletin Board”. The mods, who were very nice people, moved there to be in the ministry and there was much discussion in the forum. At that time, I was just coming out of the charismatic movement and a church that promoted the prophetic Third Wave and the “restoration of the 5-fold ministry”.
Anyway, long story short, it was this board that opened my eyes to contemplative spirituality, “soaking”, the Bridal Paradigm, and a host of other unbiblical beliefs and practices. When they were promoting the annual OneThing revival there, I posted a link to Ernie Gruen’s expose “Do We Keep Smiling and Saying Nothing?”, as well as in-depth analysis of every one of the false prophets who were featured at their horse and pony show (including Dutch Sheets, Paul Cain, Rick Joyner, Mike Bickle, and a few others whose names escape me at the moment. Needless to say, the hosts were not pleased and cut me down without even looking at the evidence. As my mother used to say, “when their minds are made up, don’t confuse them with the facts.”
I had just read “A Time of Departing” and realized why the Richard Foster practices of transcendental meditation were so dangerous when my eyes were opened to charismania; contemplative spirituality is only the tip of the iceberg of what’s wrong with IHOP. I’ve watched Bickle on YouTube a few times — he preaches on a certain passage, and reads his own subjective interpretation into it. It sounds like he’s making stuff up as he goes along (has this guy actually ever been to seminary?) and all the teenagers are sitting there with their mouths half-open, going, “Yeah, that’s deep. Amen.” ????!!!!!!
The other clips I’ve seen from IHOP are usually lots of shaking and screaming and passing out on the floor. Kind of like a frat party at Syracuse University (my alma mater; I wasn’t saved then).
The weirdest thing, though, is actually reading some of these bizarre visions and “prophecies”. Pastor Ernie detailed several of them in his writeup….some were silly; some were just gross. Some of the other anecdotes are R-rated. Bizarre, irreverent, apostate stuff is being taught there, and these young, undiscerning adults are eating it up because it’s a very carnal, flesh-pleasing twisted theology.
Anyway, that’s my $.02 on IHOP. I do love the pancake franchise of the same name, though – especially those lovely spinach and chicken crepes.
Overheard at IHOP 12/16/2009:
Well beloved, as I was saying that, the power of God hit Mark Anderson, one of YWAM’s major leaders, and the Lord reminded him of a word that the Lord had given him, which was “Two for One.” That in a meeting of major leaders of YWAM, the Lord visited him and said “For every abortion that God was going to release two souls and bring them into His kingdom.” That the greatness of His mercy, God was going to show great kindness to the earth. And for every abortion, He was going to release a mighty move, a mighty outpouring of His spirit, to bring in two souls.
-Allen Hood
http://beyondgrace.blogspot.com/2009/12/celestial-card-game.html
That was overheard at IHOP only a few weeks ago? Lord Jesus…
Allen Hood, as one writer put it in Truthspeaker’s blog..wouldn’t know a godly man even if he was walking down the street wearing a red ten gallon hat and a sign hanging around his neck.
I’d say he gets about the same, high rating when it comes to ”prophecying” over mankind & abortions…
Allen Hood and Mike Bickle are so deep into Contemplative, that when they pray, the ‘one’ they’re hearing from isn’t the ‘One’ from heaven. More like the other direction…
One must wonder if their prophecy is true, why the millions of babies already aborted haven’t resulted in the great harvest of souls they’ve all been prophesying for years.
You would think that Lakeland would have opened peoples eyes or at least have them questioning the validity of these types of revivals. God used it to open mine. I guess it is like when I point out the errors of the pent/char movment to my family members that are in it. They choose to take their experiences over what the Bible says. They prefer to use their twisted interpretation of a verse over what the verse really says. : (
Eh…
I’m hopeful that was the beginning of a prayer and not an epithet.
Hopeful (?),
- Jeff
Hello,
My name is Ross and I’m a media student here at IHOP. My friend, Christen had a long standing shoulder issue get healed while at Onething. I know, I was there. I have seen many of my friends get touched and healed since the student Awakening started at IHOP, emotionally and physically. In many instances the result has been them preaching the Gospel with boldness and many have given their lives to Christ as a result. Some say the Word isn’t mentioned during one the services. I can tell you that the Word is the central part of the IHOP fabric and is more often seen in the classes or teaching services while the Awakening services focus on prayer, worship, and ministry time. Trust me though, the Word is still the center. It seems like a strange tactic of the devil to work in people’s lives to such an extent that they share Jesus with new boldness resulting in many more coming to Christ. If that is his plan, he’s shooting himself in the foot. The whole thing of people being cut off from family or previous connections is false. I talk to my people from NH all the time. I’ve been home several times since I’ve been here and have NEVER had anyone even remotely suggest cutting off communication.
God bless,
Ross
Ross, how do you know your friend’s shoulder issue is now healed? Is there documentation of this condition prior to the healing, and has a medical doctor confirmed this healing? Exactly what kind of shoulder issue was it?
Also, what is the gospel message being boldly preached?
Lyn
Ross,
Why does it seem like all the “healing” is taking place solely at these gatherings? Why not go into hospitals and heal the people there?
“fourpointer
Ross,
Why does it seem like all the “healing” is taking place solely at these gatherings? Why not go into hospitals and heal the people there?”
because they can’t get people worked into an altered state of consciousness at the hospital. and they don’t have the gift of healing
For more IHOP craziness, go over to Slaughtering the Sheep and read Bob Jones’ wife talking about Bob’s “Tennis Shoe Prophecy”. Here’s a sample:
So, now, Bob Jones is walking around wearing prophetic sneakers! Simply Amazing!
I never knew sneakers had that kind of power. *starts checking out mine to see if they have any*
Maybe we should all check our sneakers to see if they can prophesy! LOL
nuts.
My NB say 479. I guess I am not a prophet. Hopefully though since my number is less I could be a lesser prophet.
I haven’t checked my sneakers but I looked at my boots. I wonder if that counts as power shoes that prophesy…
I wonder if cowboy boots can give off prophecy?
http://www.alittleleaven.com/2009/10/christian-flip-flops.html
Here are some “Christian” flip flops. The prophecies from these can mean one thing and then another.
My shoes have no sole…
Bummer – and I’m wearing sandals! Oh the life of me, I guess I’ll have to stick to the Scriptures.
That was a good one, Jeff H!
I guess none of us have a “prophetic word” to stand on!
I’ve been watching an IHOP service tonight on God TV. I have never even heard of this movement prior to tonight. The service is odd to watch. There’s no order in the sanctuary. Some stand, some sit on the floor, some sit in chairs, some stand with hands on each others’ shoulders. There seem to be a little prosperity talk and maybe even a hint of word faith? I did hear some prophecy talk. The man on stage, whom I’m assuming is Mike Bickle, said something about the man he was about to bring up on the stage as having been revealed to him in a prophecy but I can’t remember what the prophecy revealed about him; I think it had to do with a talent he was to have, etc.
They also had a session where some people got on stage to give their testamony. It appears that IHOP is full of a lot of young hurting people that are looking for answers and Mike Bickle is the man that has the answers they are looking for. The service was a very sad thing to watch and I hope we all as brothers and sisters in Christ will keep these people in our prayers so that God may open their eyes to the lies and open their hearts to receive Him the same as He did Lydia.
I also find it very sad that a cult service like this is being aired on something like God TV where a countless number of people can watch it and possibly be indoctrinated. I will give the people credit though, they do have a heart for worship; the worship service came on at 8:00 PM and is not going off until 12:00 AM. At our church, however, we have an hour service and by the time you take out music and announcements, etc. we are lucky to get a 20 minute sermon and with that, people still can’t wait to get out. How sad is that?
~ At our church, however, we have an hour service and by the time you take out music and announcements, etc. we are lucky to get a 20 minute sermon and with that, people still can’t wait to get out. How sad is that?~
Sadly brother Wade, that is what you can call Westernized Christianity. Most people want a quick & easy service. They don’t want one of those “take your time while feeding me the Scriptures sermons”. The likes of Rick Warren & Perry Noble are on the list of those guilty of providing the “have it your way sermon” to our culture.
IHOP does have a lot of people attending, watching, listening etc. But let’s back up on that..IHOP has a lot of young people doing all that. The only baby-boomers at IHOP are the ones at the top of the ladder, or occasional curious walking in the door.
IHOP indoctrinates the attendees on people who only go to church…they’re just being religious, they’re taught.
But why do the people attending hold Mike Bickle and Allen Hood on such a pedestal? That’s a no-brainer. Bickle has told them over and over that they are “forerunners”. They are a step ahead of the entire rest of the body of Christ. I mean wow. When you were younger, if someone told you that YOU had something really special, that you were really head and shoulders above everyone else, you would just lOVE that person – ya know?
Jesus warned the great falling away would be huge – that if it were possible, it would fool even the very elect. The IHOP people really, really do consider themselves the most prominent of the elect..
Eyes need opening badly.
Amen Annunk! Thank you for your insight. Pride is in deed very intoxicating. The IHOP thing is really starting to make sense to me. I would definitely be all about hearing someone tell me that I was head and shoulders above the rest when I was young. My carnal side would still love to hear it today; only difference is I have more discernment today from being in the word. Thank you for your post!
I just want to tell you that everything negative that everyone recently has mentioned and even past is true. I have been part of the internships at IHOP for over 3 years and I do thank God that my family got me out of there. I was not part of the leadership but saw enough to know that there is something wrong with them. I also know that many of the pastors in the area have just had it with Bickle. I went to several churches in the area since I was not getting the Cross message at IHOP it was all about Bob Jones, prophecy and dreams and what they felt the dreams meant and their interpertation of the bible. It was all foolishness I paid alot of money a total of over 18 thousand dollars to that place along with all my tithing….everytime I made some money I would be told to give it away or I would run into classmates that need the money since they had no food. I lived in one of their apartment with 2 bedrooms with 6 adults it was just wrong but I had to I was really not encouraged to be part of the program and live on my own. If you do particular programs you have to live on site. All of it was very controling. Lou Engle is just out there and wacked. I tink there is something seriously wrong with him and everyone that adores him and follows him they don’t even think for themselves they just do what he does. I knew that from the start so I tried to stay away from him, but it is hard since he often preaches. When the awakening happened it was odd too, I think most people knew people were faking it, I even did sometimes since they put the pressure on some of us that we had to feel something. Alot of mind control, not that you had to do something or they would kill you but they would alient you and make you feel like you were crap. Very clicky, Not sure if that is how you spell it but so not Jesus at all. I see all that now being in a healthy church and real community. That is another thing no real community in that place. It is like they are all glassy eyed. I was too, just like zombies following eachother round and round and not growing in Christ at all from glory to glory. Lots of money goes into that place thousands and I think probably millions but the kids (us) never saw it and we had to always beg for support. I have been on a mission trip to Africa since returning home and that was like night and day. The mission trips I was on through IHOP was nothing like I was on recently. We were building huts and really slept in the wilderness and were real missionaries at IHOP many even stayed at peoples homes or motels, I did as well everything we needed was provided – nothing like real missions work. Just stupid. I never could see asking for money to pray. I pray more now than I did then and I can’t imagine asking anyone to give me money or support so I can pray, Anna never did that. Why should we. Now I see clearly but I thank my parents for having their heads on straight and pulling me out before it really screwed me up.
Laura, so glad your eyes were opened to this cult As I was reading your story I was reminded of Hari Krishna followers, they worked on the same principles as IHOP Blessings, hope you are now in a Bible based church with strong, mature leaders who watch over their flock
David T said,
Study after study shows that after about 20 minutes, people have stopped listening. Experience after experience shows that if the person can’t make his points in 20 minutes, he probably isn’t sure what it is.
A man of God should never cut short his sermon to please the unbelieving. The true sheep should be so attentive and engrossed in the sermon that he/she loses all track of time. Our culture is fast paced with time being irrelevant to most as they claim they never have enough of it; attention spans have been shortened as a result.
May we who belong to Him never be in a hurry when it comes to hearing the word of our God.
What “studies” would those be? And who was the subject of these “studies”? And in all actuality, if a fellow can preach on a portion of Scripture in only 20 minutes, he probably hasn’t really studied the Scripture and doesn’t really have anything to say at all.
Amen, Lyn and Fourpointer:
So many can’t endure past 30 minutes of preaching (although not too long ago in Church history preachers used to preach for hours), yet they have no problems sitting in a theater watching smut for three hours then going home and plopping down in front of the X-Box for 5 hours before having to get to bed for church in the morning where after just 30 minutes they’re checking their watch.
I guess where your treasure and affections are, there also is your heart.
It’s not about cutting a sermon short, but about the fact that after about 20 minutes on one subject, the speaker is usually rambling, padding his word count, or stalling. There are exceptions, but very few.
Almost as if in a trance? And on what Biblical basis do you determine that?
You inadvertently proved another point in my favor. Because our culture is fast paced, hours-long sermons get lost, which means they are not effective. Sermons aren’t preached in Greek in America for the same reason.
Depends on the portion. The idea of a sermon is not to preach every single thing about it, but to deliver a specific point. If you can’t encapsulate it in – let’s say half an hour to be generous, you are rambling.
I’m seeing a concern here that people assume that longer = spiritual. Not necessarily. Christ spoke for hours and captivated people, but remember that He was bringing new knowledge and was God Incarnate. Pastor Ezekial Talksalot is not.
________________________________________________________________
Now I hate to be critical, but the amateur scholar in me must point out the problem with this statement, Pilgrim.
1) Preachers would preach for hours, but that tells us nothing about how much of that was actual preaching from God’s Word and how much of it was rambling, padding the word count, or stalling for time (the whole “long time = spiritual” perception).
2) X-Box is interactive; you are actively doing something when playing X-Box. Generally, you are not actively doing anything while sitting in a resting position listening to a sermon.
3) The reason people of old would listen to sermons that long is because for many of them, the choice was listening to that sermon or being cast out of the community (a death sentence back in the 1700s). There is a presumption that people used to be holier, but that is because we are not seeing everything from back then, whereas we are immersed by our current culture; hence, we compare the best of the past with the worst of today.
I’m not arguing for the approach of a buzzer that goes off after 20 minutes; shortness does not mean spiritual, either. My concern is that people automatically assume that if a sermon is long, it must be good and that if it’s short, it must be because the Western church has fallen.
Now for 4P: “What “studies” would those be? And who was the subject of these “studies”? ”
I’ll look this up again, if you’re really interested, but there were numerous studies by public speaking agencies like Toastmasters, sociological studies by universities with too much money, and Christian organizations.
072591,
First of all, I do NOT refer to my pastor as a ‘speaker’; he has been called by God to preach and teach His word. If you are referring to motivational speakers, then what you say may very well be true.
As for this…“The true sheep should be so attentive and engrossed in the sermon that he/she loses all track of time.”…and your response…
I base that on my thirsting and panting after knowledge, my desire to know and understand God as revealed in His word, my desire to serve and obey…all this is His gift as He draws me evermore to Him. I never said anything about a trance and would appreciate it if you would NOT assume such. That may be your take, but certainly it is not mine.
As for your ‘hating to be critical’, it seems as though you thrive on it, most of your comments are filled with it.
Grace and peace,
Lyn
Hi Lyn.
1: A speaker is someone who speaks, especially for a living. A pastor is a speaker (unless he is a mime), but a speaker is not necessarily a pastor. Speaking is the most visible part of his job. So, to amend my first comment, “It’s not about cutting a sermon short, but about the fact that after about 20 minutes on one subject, the speaker even if he is a pastor is usually rambling, padding his word count, or stalling. There are exceptions, but very few.”
2: Yes, a trance IS my take on it, based on how you described it. I know you didn’t use the word “trance” which is why I asked about it.
3: I notice you didn’t answer my question, so I will try to rephrase it: What is the Biblical basis for your comment: “The true sheep should be so attentive and engrossed in the sermon that he/she loses all track of time.”? The answer you did give talks about personal experience, but that is not about your statement. You made a general value statement about how the true sheep should be; since our morality needs to be derived from the Bible and not borrowed convictions, you need to give a better defense (chapter and verse)of your moral stand than, “Because it’s what I’m like.”
4: As for my often being critical, of course most of my comments are critical; when I agree and have nothing of value to add, I don’t comment. Furthermore, when I disagree, I usually don’t comment either because I don’t have anything to add that wasn’t mentioned already. Sometimes, I just don’t feel like arguing about it, sensing that there is not going to be any movement by anyone and no point continuing.
072591,
You are entitled to your opinions, my pastor is a man of God in my book, and not a ‘speaker’, he has been called by God to expound His word; a speaker has not been called by God.
As for my biblical ‘basis’ for my statement, “The true sheep should be so attentive and engrossed in the sermon that he/she loses all track of time.”: I will refer you to the Psalms: however, I will not do the work for you. You must search for yourself.
Lyn
Let me ask you this, what biblical basis do you have for calling a pastor a ‘speaker’?
Dear 072591:
Thank you for conceding what I’ve been noticing for quite a long time:
“As for my often being critical, of course most of my comments are critical”
I have noticed that a good 90 to 95% of your comments on here are critical. The reason you provided for being critical is understandable, however, it goes against rules 1 and (especially) 2 of our Rules of Engagement. Our RoE was written to make it clear what our expectations and standards are on this blog.
I have been patient (and very tolerant) with watching comment after comment from you criticize and challenge much of what is written on here. Collectively we have several people who keep us in check (oftentimes ourselves), and as rule number two states, we don’t need a resident troll or continual counter-balance arguer.
Please understand our position in light of your future comments here.
Sincerely,
- Pilgrim
….just curious, but what was this blog supposed to be about….?
Sadparent took her blog down at the Lord’s leading. Hopefully we’ll know why some day….
Her son went off, she thought, to study to become a minister. She didn’t know IHOP was what it is..
After he’d been going there (a couple years), had married another IHOP-er and had a grandkid, she started finding a lot of info about IHOP doctrine/teachings online and red flags went up that IHOP “might not” be a good place after all. She called her son and told him that from what she’d read, she thought it was possible that IHOP “might be” a cult. Long story short, her kid cut off all communication with her and she hasn’t heard from him since. I think that was back in 2007. And yes, it was due to IHOP counseling him that he cut her off.
There’s other parents, family and friends who have gone thru this as well. Isn’t IHOP just marvy???
RE: Ross’s Jan 8, 2010 comment: Ross says he’s a media student and that IHOP absolutely does not teach interns to cut off family and /or friends.
If Ross had family or friends who openly DISagreed with IHOP doctrine, Ross would know a different story. He would be counseled fairly fast to DC all communication with them and fairly fast too. Laura Mac’s April 4, 2011 comment sort of backs this up…
Pilgrim: I responded to your post by e-mail; I feel this is something best addressed privately.
Now for Lyn’s question:
I base my referring to a pastor as a speaker among other things, Biblically on the 6th commandment, not to lie. I base using the word speaker on the dictionary’s definition of speaker: 1) One who speaks, and 2) One who speaks in a formal setting. There is no negative connotation intended, nor implied. It is just an aspect of his job, and the one that he has in common with any other speaker; no pastor – nay, no any human being is so special and unique that no other word can be used to describe and define what he does. So, it’s not my opinion; it’s the English language’s opinion.
Interesting that you think that a person who claims to love the Lord and love His word would become “bored” after 20 minutes because it’s not “interactive”. Yet many of us who blog here don’t have a problem paying attention to sermons that last nearly an hour.
And yet if many of these folks who get “bored” because it’s not “interactive” went back to college I dare say they could sit through an hour-long English or Math class and give their professor more attention and even respect than they would give their pastor.
4P: You probably listen to good sermons. I know a lot of the sermons posted here are good and not just padding the word count. But I also know of many pastors, preachers, speakers in the secular world, etc. who just drag it out. Like the Bob Dylan songs, where “why sing it in 3 minutes when you can sing it in 10?” I can read Dr. Suess’s “The Cat in the Hat” and talk almost an hour doing it, but you’ll get bored rather quickly – even if you like the story.
“… after about 20 minutes on one subject, the speaker [not necessarily a pastor] is usually rambling, padding his word count, or stalling. There are exceptions, but very few.” This is what I said, in my clarifying comments. So yes, a person who loves the Lord and loves His Word can be bored from a sermon after 20 minutes – if the sermon is dragged out. I find it more interesting that you think that it is impossible for a sermon to be good if it doesn’t reach a particular amount of time.
As for sitting through an hour-long English or math class and paying more attention, don’t be so sure. In every college I’ve been to, the hour was interactive; the lecturer-style of a speaker talking for an hour is being abandoned because it does not work. It is one of the least effective ways of transmitting information.
Here is an example of time, length, and dragging things out. We’re going to go into professional wrestling. Just bear with me, and I promise it’ll all make sense.
One of the best matches in of all time was at Wrestlemania 12 between Shawn Michaels and Bret Hart. A classic match that is considered one of the standards by which other matches are judged. It went for over an hour! It was an Iron Man Match (duration of one hour, whoever gets the most pins wins). It even went into overtime when it ended in a tie. It captivated audiences because it was a fantastic match. Every minute of the 62 minutes was compelling and told a story. Further, there was no “it can end at any moment” feel. The match was advertised as lasting for an hour.
By contrast, the match between Jerry Lawler and Michael Cole at Wrestlemania 27 was for 11 minutes, and was drawn out. The people started moving slower, the ref counted slower, and it felt like just stalling for time. “This is boring” was being chanted at many points throughout the match.
62 minutes is a lot longer than 11. Same type of audience, same atmosphere, the same basic concept – two people in tights pretending to fight. But the 62 minute match is loved, and talked about fifteen years later, while the 11 minute match is considered to have been too long by 8 minutes.
So how long should a sermon be? Long enough to get across what you are saying and not one second longer. Sometimes, it will be an hour. Sometimes, it will be 20 minutes. And sometimes, the sermon needs to be split into 2 shorter sermons. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with a “to be continued” at the end.
072591:
In the field of education it is true that people can retain more, if as many of their senses can be involved in the learning process as possible. So I see your point. And I understand that not all pastors are truly pastors, but merely public speakers. And some not even good at that.
But here’s the issue that I think Lyn and 4P were getting at. The things of the Spirit are not dependent on our learned techniques. So the speaker who uses interactive techniques to engage the audience is appealing to “the wisdom of men” if you will, rather than in the power of God. It’s the words of God themselves that are life, not the human technique in which they are too often packaged, marketed and sold. The problem of efficacy is not in engaging the mind or soul with technique, but in dealing with the depravity of the human heart (which is a spiritual matter).
And thus for the true follower of Christ, his heart is set on the things of God, he hungers and thirsts after truth and righteousness, he feeds on God’s word as if he were starving, and can’t seem to get enough of it. And he would just as well sit for 8 hrs straight (and more) listening to the things of God. The “foolishness of preaching” being God’s means of reaching past the soul into the spirit.
Bingo David W!
Now, enough time has been spent on this topic, let’s move on…
Lyn
My Name is Kara and I was hoodwinked by IHOP for over 6 years. I lived and breathed that place, I believed in the foundation of it and was lied to over and over again by the leadership. I saw many people come and go through that time but many that stayed year after year like myself and I would say to myself this must be okay it must be a good thing since so many talented people are here. But I was wrong. So wrong and because I did not seek and search and diligently do my research a veil was over my eyes for years and no one could tell me otherwise. Some of my friends left this place and found the truth of the scriptures but many others stayed but yet I did not get it maybe because deep inside I did not want to know the truth. I wanted to believe I could not be fooled or deceived I knew too much word, I had too much of a great relationship with Jesus to be hoodwinked. But I was and I finally see this now. What took me seeing it, I really can’t say one thing, maybe it was when they fired someone in my department at IHOP when she was questioning money funds, maybe it was all the people that got sick through fasting so much and then having to be hospitalized and then having David Sliker state “Oh but we don’t force people to fast”. Or maybe it was when I started to work for the city of Jackson and noticed how many homes were owned by Diane and Mike Bickle that had no loans on them and how Mike Bickle has many different addresses and he isn’t living as much as a fasted lifestyle as he preaches. or maybe it was when I went to one session near the Prayer Room that did soaking sessions and the woman was sharing how she use to be part of IHOP and then found the truth behind herself being lied to and hoodwinked and finding the deeper love of the Father through the time she actually was as IHOP. Or maybe it was when I noticed one day how my so called IHOP friends were really only acquaintances and not REAL friends because IHOP really doesn’t have a real community and does not know how to love one another as the bible teaches. I can’t tell you it was one thing or another I can only tell you it was a combination of things and through that combination of things, I have found the road of truth and the path to my glorious Father and have left this cult to seek and live the life Jesus died to give me. I tell anyone in this cult or thinking of it…do your research, the facts are clear and they are all within your reach Father God has allowed it be clear, but you must be willing to seek it in order to find it. Seek and you shall find, don’t be ignorant..and don’t just continue in the lies just because you think it is from the Lord, it is not! Let Him (TRUTH) show you. Just seek!
Kara, may the Lord be praised for rescuing you out of that cult. Thank you for your comment.
I realize this thread started a long time ago but unfortunately the IHOP cult continues. Thank you for leaving this up! I hope other young people who came out of IHOP will share their stories because I have found them very helpful in trying to rescue other young people who I work with on a daily basis.
I am a college instructor and my husband and I are pastors and campus missionarie sent out by our church specifically to reach college students. I am a Spirit-filled Christian and have encountered the fringes of the Third Wave movement here and there throughout my walk with Christ since five years old. The false doctrines and dangerous practices of IHOP and other Third Wavers have been documented over and over again, and yet the young people I work with have no clue. We forget it is all new to them. What IHOP looks like to them is a more outward move of God than anything they have probably seen in their home churches and it is natural for young people to want more emotion, energy and involvement in their worship. Some of that is good but they have no balanced examples elsewhere. I am not trying to be critical in saying that as a Speech teacher 072591 had a point about the attention span past twenty minutes. His point that longer does not necessarily equal more spiritual was valid, although I don’t believe that was Lyn’s intent to say. Why it does apply to the situation is that it would be a mistake to think longer sermons = more spiritual just as much to believe like most kids sucked into IHOP that: more emotional = closer to Jesus; more fasting = closer to Jesus; more personal prophecy = God is speaking; and yes, even longer services,sermons and prayers = more spiritual.
As a conference speaker who has taught much longer than 20 minutes I do practice breaking that time up with either a change of subtopic, approach, interaction, etc. in order to keep the audience’s mind fresh and engaged. I do believe we need to all actively judge right doctrine because even a great pastor can be mistaken at times. At IHOP they realize that working the crowd up into a trance-like state means they are less likely to be able to judge well. Most of the time when a young person says to me, “that was a great teaching!” by one of the IHOP crowd, I ask what was said. The young people can never really tell me what was taught. They just had a perception it was good.
The more time they have spent partaking of IHOP the more confused we find their thinking. What I cannot explain is that many of them can quote lots of scripture and spend a good deal of time in the Word and yet have very twisted thinking and interpretation. I think it is because they don’t actually use their reasoning. We once took a group of students and played an audio teaching of a popular IHOP teacher for the group. We asked them to critically listen and write down all the good/correct doctrine in one column and any bad/concerns in another. Without our having to teach or say anything they, as a group, were eventually able to pick out some very false doctrine. They were shocked! Most of them had listened to that teaching over and over again and never heard it before! As is pointed out in this thread, what they did hear consistently was a message about how they were special, more spiritual, the forerunners and the one’s who would usher in Jesus.
We have seen marriages destroyed by IHOP, young people confused and turn away from the faith because of IHOP, groups of students torn apart because of the holier-than-thou attitude of IHOPers, and some people who had things “imparted” to them had to go through deliverance. A few even ended up in the hospital or psych ward. Once girl couldn’t stop shaking uncontrollably even in the middle of her college classes, another developed a nervouse tick in her face she couldn’t control, another was plagued by fear, etc. At the same time we have had many claim they grew closer to Jesus than ever before and actually started reading the Bible more than before. Ultimately most people in that cult end up spiritually stunted, but sometimes that happens in traditional churches too.
Most of the evidence has been about experiences, and I admit that I want to hear more of those because they do inspire young people to listen. I have massive evidence of wrong teaching and false doctrine that I share but IHOPers usually do a good job of twisting out of those arguments when confronted, or most of the time they have preempted any arguments by telling the young people what we critics will say to them ahead of time. This is typical of a cult. They also have been very careful of late to edit what is put on their website and even directly lie about things they have said. They tell the people at IHOP they have to do that to protect themselves because most of us aren’t spiritual enough to handle the truth. All I can say is that we need to shout truth from the housetops! Thank you for this website and continuing this thread. Let’s keep being vigilant for our enemy is still presenting a false face to our young people!
Thanks for the comments here. I am researching on IHOP because I have recently met some people who are trying tO set up an IHOP ministry near where I live. I knew very little about IHOP at the time, but some red flags were raised as they definitely have an attitude of being on a higher level of spiritual understanding. They went on about the experience they had in the prayer room at IHOP, and how intense the presence of God is in there. I have watched the webcast of the prayer room, and found nothing too alarming in and of itself. There was some great worship music played by worship leader Misty Edwards. In reading up on IHOP though, I have gathered info on the New Apostolic Reformation (read that “self appointed/anointed so called Apostles, Mike Bickle being one of them), IHOP and Dominionism. Also some of the testimonies from those who left IHOP is very informative, and disturbing. I still need to read up more. I know what it is like to be caught in some cultic ministry with an elite attitude as that happened to me when I was young and naive.