40 thoughts on “Taking a closer look at Todd Bentley . . . literally.

  1. umm, whats the point of this post about Todds tattoos?
    While I believe Todd is a false prophet, I dont think the people (I’ve seen other blog posts about them) who are focusing on his tats have any ground to claim those as part of his false prophecies, I mean, they may or may not be symbols of the occult.
    I have 5 tats, 2 of which are christian, one being a hebrew written proverb. Im very conservative and reformed in my doctrine and thinking and I lead bible studies.
    This guys tats are just another form or outlet of his over-the-top expression of his wacked-out faith.
    Don’t read too much into them.
    and I hope no one ever judges my faith and my love for my God by my appearance…..

  2. Bro. Pilgrim,

    I had the opportunity to address the youth group at my father’s former church where he resigned from to start a mini-Lakeland church. During the 3 hours I spoke, I showed the tattoos and their meanings to 16 and 17 years old, and they could see something was up!

    Why does he have Japanese writing on his arm, not being Japanese or speaking it? Why does he have pictures which could only be described as demonic, while claiming to be a man of God.

    Leviticus 19:28 clearly forbids one to make any cuttings on the flesh, or make any marks on their body. Clearly Bentley must feel he is above the Bible…

  3. shall we say christian themed tattoo?
    i have psalm 46:10 in hebrew on my arm, while i don’t speak or read hebrew, its a great reminder to “Be still” and a great witness tool.
    Leviticus also clearly states:
    do not bear grudges
    wear 2 kinds of material as clothing
    eat nothing with the blood in it
    V27 round off sideburns or harm edges of beard
    V28 make cuts in the flesh forthe dead
    V4 turn to idols or make them
    V11 steal, lie
    v15 be partial in judgment
    v16 slander
    V17 do not hate your neighbor
    We can not pick and choose which ‘law’ we allow for people.
    Lets see who can cast that first stone from this list.
    Todds tattoos should not be the focal point to prove he is above the law, his ‘teaching’ does that.
    What exactly is the meaning of the tats?
    What reeks of occult?
    the fire, flowers, lion and the lamb, dove, Jesus face, star of David, the word revelation or the thing (angel looking) on his leg?
    His teaching is false, his ways will be found out and God the ultimate judge will condemn him.
    You do a great job in defending truth and contending for the faith. I like this site, but we must be careful.
    And I’m still curious what was the thought that went into this post?
    Kristina

  4. Douglas:

    Thank you for your comment. I still haven’t figured out the creature on Bentley’s leg, but I can assure you it’s nothing you’ll see in Heaven.

    It’s unfortunate that you can examine anything about Bentley but don’t dare question (or simply post pictures without even commenting on) the nature of the tattoos he elected to adorn his body with after he began his “ministry.”

    These tattoos were done after he was supposedly beamed up through a portal, put on an operation table in “heaven,” cut open, and had boxes stuffed into him (because God was running out of time). Seriously, here’s the video.

    I figured someone would have a knee-jerk reaction to me posting Bentley’s tattoos and charge (or imply) that I was judging Bentley by his tattoos (while they are judging me for supposedly judging Bentley). It comes with the territory I suppose.

    krislinatin:

    The post was simply “taking a closer look at Bentley.” If you want to take a defensive stance, so be it, but this post does not make or break Bentley as the false prophet he is. I posted this to let the readers decide, just like you claim the being on his leg is an “angel.” Oh, I’m sure it is, but then again, this post is for readers to decide and comment on (like you did). That’s why I didn’t post any of my own commentary.

    Bentley defenders (not you) charge we don’t know enough about him (to fall under his spell) so this post was showing just a little bit more. If you’re going to make a case against me for making a case against Bentley and camp on this post as your battleground, then you missed the point of the many posts preceding this one. It’s not about tattoos. It’s about the man behind the tattoos. But like it or not, a man’s words, actions, dress, appearance, and yes, his body art says a lot about him. Appearance (tattoos) are often an outward expression of the inward person. They don’t make the person, but they oftentimes reflect what’s within.

    I have absolutely no intention (nor desire) to debate the merits of tattoos and whether Christians should be getting them (in spite of the fact that we are instructed time and time again to quit being like the world). If you want to tattoo yourself, that’s your choice. I’m not reading more into any of this than that, and I’m not implying any more into this than that. Don’t make a mountain out of a molehill, krislinatin.

    I don’t “judge” Bentley by his tattoos. I “judge” him by his fruit (e.g. false prophecies, false teachings, heretical doctrines of demons, the preaching of another gospel, etc). Or like when Bentley declares a man healed yet he dies a week later.

    People will find themselves in Hell because they believed Bentley’s lies, not because of his tattoos. I hope you understand.

    – The Pilgrim

  5. wow. i think the leg tatt does look like an angel, of course it does look a little scary, which I imagine angels will (more like this then a “precious moments” angel, that’s for sure). not that his tatts make me want to follow him. maybe he would be good for some biker ministry or something.
    p.s. it is not believing bentley’s lies that will send people to hell. God sent people there himself when he didn’t choose them before the foundation of the world and give them as a gift to His son.

  6. Bro. Pilgrim,

    Like all man-made revivals, this is self-worship and hero-worship clothed in Christian garb. I call it self-worship, because these people are flocking there for what they can get. You think this is bad? Find a predominantly West African congregation in “revival” – makes Bentley looks like an amateur of amateurs. People passing out, having trances, “visions”…very scary.

    However it is also hero worship, as you need a leader to “shepherd the move of God”. This leader becomes the apostle, prophet and shepherd who has free rein to do as he pleases – sound familiar???

  7. Is there a photo of the Tat on his leg of the angel? I don’t see it above.

    Also

    “I don’t “judge” Bentley by his tattoos. I “judge” him by his fruit (e.g. false prophecies, false teachings, heretical doctrines of demons, the preaching of another gospel, etc).”

    Can you please give me examples of this. So far you guys have nothing. I am open feed me some false friut.

  8. The tattoo on his leg is the ‘symbol’ from one of the heavy metal “christian” rock bands. I don’t remember which one, but the name is on his myspace. The whole thing makes me weep, as this is nothing but a mockery against God.

  9. Dear Adam:

    Thank you for your comment.

    I’m not sure if you’ve checked out all the posts on Bentley on DefCon, but there has been ample information on him (so much info, in fact, that I published my last post on him here because nothing more needs to be said). It seems that most of his defenders are only interested in debating the tattoo issue and they conveniently stay away from the issues they know they can’t defend (at least not from a Scriptural standpoint).

    So if your inquiry is serious, then I recommend starting with this post and ask yourself if Bentley’s “god” is directing people to or away from the only True and Living Son of God: the mark of a true false prophet!

    – The Pilgrim

  10. That mess on his leg is a demon
    Emma is Emma sans the “O”. It is a Japanese deity, in other words a demon masquerading as a god (little “g”) They call him Emma-O and he is surrounded by gold and silver and other nonsense which sounds eerily similar to Toddy boy. With the supposed gold falling down yah it was Emma alright!

    1Jo 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world

    2Cr 11:13 For such [are] false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness

    Pilgrim keep on contending and defending I’m standing with you!
    ~Anointed

  11. No one cares about creating offense against a Christian brother or sister? Those who are happy to tattoo themselves, in spite of the offense they create against other believers are no longer acting in love, but acting in a willful and independent way. Our brother above who leads Bible studies should know his Bible better.

    A case in point is that, traditionally, tats are associated with the rebels of the world. Postmodernism, which favors that which is against traditional Christian “truth” has made the likes of tattoos appear “cool”. Yet, to the older generation they are always associated with those who live wanton lives. Hence they are offensive and Christians have an obligation to refrain from creating any offense!

    Is a Christian free to drink alcoholic beverages? Yes, because the Scripture only says to avoid drunkenness. However, if I as a Pastor – no, just as a Christian – I were to drink out at a club and some young Christian were to witness that, I may lead them down a path that could cause them to stumble. After all, the mature person is under obligation to help those who are young in the faith.

    Is it wrong for a Christian to have tattoos? I believe it should be avoided and is not commendable. 1 Cor. 9 is no argument against this. Quite the contrary, read in it’s context, it supports my argument.

  12. Interesting pictures, I have heard on different forums how occultic these tattoos are, for instance, the picture of Jesus is supposed to be upside down, etc. The pictures here give context to what I’ve seen written about them.

    I’ve got tattoos, and I had them after I became a Christian, because I had been brought up in an ultra-religious family, where everything was forbidden except for weddings and anniversaries, when I became born again, I realised that I am FREE in Christ, and to celebrate my freedom I had a small rose tattoo – extremely daring for me personally. I did not do it to offend anyone, I did not do it to show off, I did it because of the freedom the Christ gives us – not as a licence to sin, but freedom from man-made law.

    I saw Todd Bentley on GOD TV, and was willing to give the benefit of the doubt, but then he said that the viewers should get this impartation and fellowship with the prince of the air – that did it for me, the prince of the air is Satan, and I don’t want anything to do with THAT kind of spirit..!

  13. LOOK into other spirits not the spirit of God. Bentley himself said he was possessed by demons after his conversion. This can not be according to the Bible. His tattoos could be and most likely are of evil. Pray for him.

  14. Faith, I think there’s a better way to celebrate your freedom in Christ, than by breaking GOD’S WORD, that clearly says in Leviticus 19:28 “Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the LORD”.
    It is also rebellious and selfish because you act like if God didn’t create you good enough and you’re trying to change His original design.If God likes tattoo22s, He would create us with one or few. Real freedom will never make you the slave of your freedom!

  15. I’m from Asia. In my country, only hardcore criminals have tattoos. There are no tattoo shops because tattooing is illegal and a serious social taboo. Convicts get tattoos in prison after being initiated into gangs and secret societies. While most of the tattoos are gang signs, others are occultic symbols – talismans. Convict gangs have blood pacts with underworld spirits to obtain power and invincibility. Once tattooed, a man belongs to the gang and its ruling spirit forever.

  16. Quoting Leviticus 19v28 in this argument shows how poorly some people “use” scripture… just pick out the verse which reinforces your cultural “wisdom”… as has already been pointed out the previous verse (part of the same passage) says…

    “Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard”

    so surely, this verse should be taken with the same seriousness/weight as the following verse?

    As has been said before… the issue with Bentley is much more to with his theology than with his appearance whether you think it is to his credit or otherwise!

  17. It’s not just Leviticus; the prophets of Baal marked and cut themselves, so have plenty of others who served other gods.

    The answer to this whole quandry is simple; what would Jesus do? He’s our example. Did Jesus look like this?

    So, everyone take your WWJD bracelets and give it some thought.

  18. God prohibited tattoos in Leviticus because in the ancient pagan Middle East body art was used to signify the deity to whom you belonged. This will happen again with the mark of the beast.

    Christians are under no prohibition from tattooing themselves with purely decorative stuff, at least. But it remains a form of self-mutilation, and I would think very hard before putting myself under the ministry of anyone who did that.

  19. Any tattoo or marking on the body is sinful and clearly forbidden by God. He doesn’t care what the pic or theme is, it is a sin. Your body is your temple, Keep it Holy.

  20. Ultimately one is not going to be damned to hell for getting a tattoo. Don’t be so legalistic in your views on this. Yes leviticus forbids the marking of skin but are we also to observe the rest of the the laws in there? No we aren’t because God gave the Israelites those rules to set them apart from their pagan neighbours. Likewise I guess today we are to be in the world but not of it and sadly many Chrisians don’t get this.

    Now what I am not promoting is antinomianism…that is a disolvency of the law. We are to seek to obey God in every area of our lives because according to Paul we are to be no longer conform to the patterns of this world but be transformed by the renewing of our minds. But we will not be sent to hell, and nor is one a false convert if he/she gets a tatoo. The truly regenerate person will want to obey God out of love though, not legalistic, pietistic duty. We are all growing in our knowledge and understanding of Christ, but what do we do then if a younger brother or sister who is not mature in their faith goes out and gets a small tatoo one day? Do we say “YOU SINNER REPENT OF THIS DASTARDLY DEED OR PERISH!”…or do we not say

    I think with tattoos some Christians can be quick to condemn when in reality they have a God-given conscience for a reason. We are moving into the realm of folly when we start bikcering over the tatoo debate because it really is not an issue pertaining to salvation.

    I myself wouldnt get a tattoo because my conscience would not let me, but others may be different. Your moving into the realm of pharisaism when you start saying you can’t do this, you have to do that. Your taking away God’s grace here. Bentley’s false theology is the issue not his tatts. Yes ok some of them are weird and almost demonic in appearance, but with all due respect I’ll discern Bentley in relation to his theology and fruit not his Biker appearance. I think its a disgrace that some Christians condemn others for their appearance. We are no better off than the non-believing pagan culture that judges people on their appearance.

    However I agree with what Pilgrim says about this post being simply taking a closer look at Bentley. I don’t think the post is judgemental, although i do think some of us on here have turned it into a condemnation of anyone who has tatoos or gets one. For all we know they could have repented to it already to God.

    If you think a person is wrong for getting a tattoo so be it. But its wrong to start condeming them or calling them sinners or heathens. Stick to discerning and seeking to rebuke in love those who preach lies and false gospels and stop disagreeing over something that quite frankly doesn’t affect salvation.

  21. Oh, and in case I didn’t make my self clear in my last post regarding Bentley….i’m not a fan. In fact I think he talks nonsense, is unbiblical and therefore I reject his teaching as false. But i don’t reject him because of his tattoos. They may well be just the sign of a deeper problem. But who can claim to know?

  22. I’m not saying he is or he isn’t but, one thing I would like to say is Jesus Christ does not look at outward appearances! And Jesus Christ certianly does not look at one’s past!!!!! If that is the case then Why did Jesus die on the cross! It says in the bible WE ARE ALL SINNERS AND FALL SHORT OF THE GLORY OF GOD! I don’t believe that God would not use a person for his glory because of his past! That doesn’t even make sense to me because that’s why he died! When we become born agian we are a new creature in Christ! Are past is non existant to him! So, does his tattoos matter! NO Does it matter if he got them 10 years ago or is getting one tomorrow. No. Does his past matter. No. If anything that would give him a even greater reason to preach God’s word in my opionion! Because he has struggled with Drugs and sin and admits it! Jesus Christ forgave him, once agian that’s why he died! WE ARE ALL SINNERS!

  23. Praise Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior for leaving us the Holy Spirit to guide us and teach us. This brings me so much comfort after watching someone like Todd claim to represent something as Holy and true as the Word of God and Jesus. If what Todd brings to the table was Holy then why does it give me the creeps. It truly scares me in a get away from him as quickly as possible sort of way. Jesus would never make you feel that way. His yolk is easy and His burden is light. He is the Way the Truth and the Life and worshipping Him feels clean and Holy, listening to Todd feels wicked and dirty. Even looking at his body decor makes me so uneasy. No giggling, outbursts, screaming or barking, just good old fashioned peace and joy beyond all understanding. All Glory be to you forever and ever to our precious Savior, the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords. The Name above every Name, Jesus Christ.

  24. I don’t have an issue with Bentleys tattoos – I have a lot of tattoos myself, at least half of them having a christian theme. I guess the only thing I can say in my defence is that I hope the way I live my life will help pepole look past the artwork. The issues I have with Bentley are to do with his theology, and with the fact that when i saw him on GOD TV, before his “fall” it seemed like he was the star of the “Todd Bentley Show”

  25. Todd Bentley has stated that he is a former biker/gang member and has been to prison. I have seen pictures of him clean-cut long before he was really in the spotlight and he did not have any visible tattoos, this was around the time Pat King/Patricia Coking (what’s up with the name change btw?) was introducing him and having him on her show. His tattoos all seem to have a religious theme to them and it baffles me to think a hardened gang member is going to put that kind of tattoo all over himself. In his own testimony he states that he was on drugs before his teen years and that he got his tattoos before becoming a Christian. Yet he was clean cut on Pat’s show. It appears to me that he got the tattoos after becoming a Christian. It does not add up. What is the truth?

  26. my bible tells me not to judge others and he who has no sin trow the first stone..

    “1Jo 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world”

    seems this is talking about “spirits” .. if you hear a voice and it goes against gods word rebuke it with gods word (the sword).. Jesus did this when he was tempted by the devil.

  27. In Bible times men and women sat on separate sides of church and women were admonished to stay silent during the services. People judged women who wore pants to church 30 years ago; now most people wear pants or even jeans, not to mention shorts. Women were expected to wear high heels and have their hair and makeup immaculate in the 50’s; today it’s birkenstocks and extensions or dreads. Bucking tradition isn’t necessarily a sin….it’s just change, and we tend to be scared of change because we don’t understand what we can’t see. Todd’s tattoos are not demonic. They mean things to him that we may not understand, but they also give him a rapport with the tattooed crowd that a clean cut, suit-wearing man from the burbs may never achieve. People used to view piercings, even of the ears, to be taboo. Times change. We have to remember the scripture that says, “The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.” (I Samuel 16:7) Todd’s meetings are leading to people dedicating their lives to the Lord. He reaches the unreachable. He appeals to the people who wouldn’t normally darken the doors of a church. His methods may be unorthodox, but I, for one, am not going to judge him. That job is God’s, not mine. I am exhorted in the Word to love my brother and pray for him, not gossip and backbite. We really need to search our hearts and see what our motives are. God is praised and exalted even in meetings run by a tattooed man. The skin is not the heart. The outward appearance is not the personality. God forbid someone look at those who are so quick to judge and do the same to them because of a physical attribute that will not be there on judgement day!!!

  28. emergingclarity,

    It isn’t the excess of tattoos that should trouble you, it’s the faulty doctrine that Bentley teaches- the ‘healings’ he claims to have power to do and yet, there is not one shred of evidence that he has ever healed anyone. There has never been any evidence that any word/faith ‘healer’ has ever healed anybody of anything.
    He claims to cure cancer by kicking people {http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2193573/Todd-Bentley-Tattooed-preacher-cures-cancer-kicking-people-face-banned-entering-UK.html}. Good grief! Did the Lord Jesus use physical force when He healed? Bentley has no healing power whatsoever. People seek after him for the same reason many sought the Lord while He was on earth, they want a temporal healing to a physical defect/illness; they have no desire to be ‘healed’ of their greatest and deadliest disease, which is sin. Neither Bentley, nor any man/woman has the power to heal a sinner of the disease of sin; no magic formula can bring about salvation, only grace given as a gift by God can bring a sinner to Christ for salvation.
    Todd Bentley was unfaithful in his marriage – he committed adultery, and he divorced his wife and remarried; so is he even qualified, according to the word of God, to be a preacher? “The bishop therefore must be without reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober minded, orderly, given to hospitality, apt to teach; no brawler, no striker; but gentle, not contentious, no lover of money’…{read in its entirety, 1 Timothy 3:2-7} His divorce is unbiblical, he is not qualified to be a preacher of the word of God.
    Bentley claims he was told by God to preach angels, not Jesus {http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4U2rHfRpvyU } The main and central message of the entire Bible is Jesus Christ, not angels. Why would God, if He did give ‘extra-biblical revelation’ tell someone to preach on angels and not Jesus Christ? What is the sinner’s greatest need? Is it not the gospel of Christ? The Almighty One would never instruct a true man of God to steer away from Christ and point people to angels, this is more false revelation from a false teacher.

    This has been said before, but it is worth repeating…if this guy truly had ‘healing’ power, then why doesn’t he go {quietly, without make a public display of it} to a children’s hospital and heal all the young children who are terminally ill?

  29. unworthy1-lyn: Thanks for the quick answer. Truthfully, I should have researched more before I applied my fingers to the keyboard. I have been educated more on Mr. Bentley by your response. However, I do have a couple points where I’m going to have to disagree with you here.
    First of all, Jesus didn’t heal quietly and without making a public display. He often, in fact, caused a bit of a stir when he chose who to heal. Now please understand I’m not comparing T. Bentley to Jesus, but in my experience sometimes people need to be desperate enough to seek out the healing before they get it. The man by the pool that the angel stirred up just wasn’t fast enough to get to the water. Jesus healed him anyhow. He was criticized for healing on the Sabbath, for goodness’ sake! His ministry wasn’t silent or inconspicuous in the least. So, if we look to Jesus for an example, then for Todd to go to a hospital to heal doesn’t hold much water. None of us know what God has in mind or why He chooses to heal the people He heals. It’s not our choice. Perhaps, had Mr. Bentley been told by God to go to a children’s hospital and pray for the sick children there, he would have done so. We don’t know.
    Secondly, there are an awful lot of pastors out there these days who have been divorced. I’m not saying I agree with it….in fact, I think it’s wrong. However, a sin is a sin is a sin, and since no one sin is higher or worse than another, and since we are saved by grace through faith, being a sinner is far from being enough to disqualify anyone from preaching the Gospel.
    As for the physical force, I agree that Jesus didn’t get that kind of physical with people. However, he did spit in the dirt and use the paste to rub in a blind man’s eyes. I found an anecdote involving Kenneth Hagin that involved punching a sick person when he was directed to do so by the Lord when he was praying for her healing: http://www.bibleresourcecentre.com/Volume_1/PDFs/ChristsHealingMethods.pdf
    God is not the God of the ordinary. That’s one reason the body of Christ is so diverse – He reaches all people, not just certain races, creeds, or income levels.
    I listened to the youtube link. The point of Todd’s message was that people believe in Jesus but that they don’t believe in the supernatural any more. He didn’t say they should worship angels. He doesn’t preach angels. He preaches what he feels is the whole Gospel or good message, and for the people who believe like him, that includes the supernatural – healings, prophecy, words of wisdom and knowledge, and all the other things that go with it. Taking one sentence, or part of the sentence, out of a whole article is taking it out of context. This is what causes wars and crusades, is it not?
    My basic premise is that I have enough of a hard time keeping my own nose clean – I hardly have the time, effort, or spiritual authority to judge another. They could very well look at snippets from my own life and come to some pretty condemning conclusions if they wanted to. Leave Todd Bentley to his own devices. He will answer to God in the end whether he is doing right or not. God knows his motives and his drive far better than we do. He sees the end from the beginning. It’s my job more than anything to keep my own life lined up with the Word of God and to provide the best witness I can whether in word or deed. I will answer to God on the judgement day just like you and Todd Bentley and Billy Graham and OJ Simpson. Like I said earlier, a sin is a sin is a sin. None are bigger and badder than any other. And, if you read the Word, you’ll see that “all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.” (Romans 3:23) If we hadn’t, there wouldn’t be a need for the saving grace of God, now would there? If we spent less time judging others, we’d have more time to witness and shine the light of the Gospel into a hurting and dying world. Maybe that’s a better use of our time, no? God bless you.

  30. Emergingclarity,

    Jesus’ healings were not circus displays, he never got physical with any of those he healed. His healings were spontaneous, and were done to verify he was who he claimed to be. Bentley has no power to heal, if he did, there would be proof. Can you provide rock solid evidence that Bentley has healed, and that those who may make such a claim actually had a proven illness to begin with? These hard core facts have never been documented by any in the word faith movement who claim to have ‘power’ to heal. That isn’t to say God doesn’t heal, but there is no evidence He does so in our day through man.

    Concerning Kenneth Hagin, his false teachings include – “Receiving healing, just as receiving salvation, is simply a matter of appropriating what already belongs to us (6/90); healing is included in the gospel (8/92); God does not afflict people with sickness and disease (12/90); he (Hagin) went to heaven and talked with his sister (6/91); Jesus appeared to him in a vision in 1950 (8/91); he once went to hell in an out-of-body experience (9/91); he does not believe in sickness and disease (7/92); it is always God’s will to heal the sick (12/92); believers have a legal and redemptive right to divine healing (1/93). Hagin says: “Your confession of faith in God’s Word will bring healing or whatever it is you need from God into the present tense and make it a reality in your life!” (12/92). (Reported in the 2/1/93, Calvary Contender.) {from http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/hagin/general.htm}

    I am going to give you a couple of links and strongly encourage you to read them with an open mind. I also recommend you watch Justin Peter’s teachings on the word of faith/prosperity preachers; these are lengthy videos, but they are worth your while. here are the links – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t17fo2yvv3I part two –
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34SFte9b9os and finally, part three- if you do not watch the other two, please do not miss this video where he speaks specifically on ‘healing’ – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrelaKBbhJE

    lastly, I recommend to you this link, from John MacArthur – http://www.gty.org/resources/sermons/90-60/does-god-still-heal

    One more thing, you say we should spend less time judging others, however, the word of God calls us to judge those inside the church – “For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church?” 1 Corinthians 5:12
    The word ‘judge’ comes from the Greek krinō {pronounced kree’-no|
    and is defined by Strong’s as ‘Properly to distinguish, that is, decide (mentally or judicially); by implication to try, condemn, punish: – avenge, conclude, condemn, damn, decree, determine, esteem, judge, go to (sue at the) law, ordain, call in question, sentence to, think.’ I give you this to bring clarity to the various definitions of judge, and how to discern the proper meaning within the context of how it is used.

  31. Hi unworthy1-lyn:
    As someone who has experienced healing at not one, but two different times in my life after having hands laid on me, I believe we’re going to have to agree to disagree on this part of the discussion. You don’t know what it feels like unless you’ve been there. Having suffered from cluster headaches for several years, being healed at a service one night was like being let out of prison after receiving a life sentence, I’d suspect. These headaches were incapacitating, and then the person who was doing the ministering mentioned the headaches, and I went up for prayer. I left the service headache-free and have not suffered a cluster headache since. No, it wasn’t verified by a doctor. Does that make it any less real? Not for me! I know what happened to me and nobody can dispute it.

    I agree with anyone who says that the word of faith or prosperity gospel is a bunch of hogwash. God never promised us houses in gated communities or expensive cars or timeshares. In fact, it says in the Word that we will suffer tribulations in this life. I never bought into the “name it – claim it” thing. They’d say (and they HAVE said) it’s because I don’t have enough faith. I counter that with my knowledge that God doesn’t love me any less because I’m not rich – in fact, we’re not even upper middle class. Still, I’m just as saved as the next guy, and in times of financial struggle I can cope far better than people who live in fancy houses and have forgotten how to get by on very little or even less.

    That said, I still hold to my claim that healing is for today, and God most certainly uses man, or woman, as a vessel or point of contact for that healing. I admire your conviction, but like I said we’re going to have to agree to disagree on that. I won’t take the time to watch the videos because I know what they’re about and just like I can’t change your mind you’re not going to change mine. My faith, after 45 years, is the strongest it’s ever been. However, I don’t buy into anyone’s gospel just because they say it works. I have in my heart a genuine, deep, lasting love for God and His people, and when He leads me to pray for the sick I do so. It may be that you never believe that God uses mankind for healing in this day and age, and that’s cool.

    The most important thing is that we agree that Jesus is the Son of God, that He died for our sins, and that by confessing with our mouth and believing in our hearts that He is Lord we will become His child. I believe in personal salvation – I don’t know if you do or not…..some denominations don’t and others do – and I believe that what I know, I will be held accountable for on judgement day. We all have different experiences and a different testimony. Mine is that God heals today, often by the laying on of hands. Sometimes it looks weird, but I’m pretty sure that Jesus telling someone to take up his bed and walk looked weird too. We’re all different and have different needs and wants in this life. What matters is that we come to a saving knowledge of Jesus. And, Todd Bentley and everyone else aside, I pray that you have done so. I accepted Jesus into my heart when I was 14 years old and have never turned back. That, to me, is more important than any discussion here, because it is eternally relevant. Thanks for the discussion. I really appreciate your civility.

  32. emergingclarity: “I know what happened to me and nobody can dispute it.”

    Actually, anyone can dispute it. In the mouth of two or three witnesses is a matter established. That’s what God says. If He wanted others to accept your word, He would provide multiple witnesses. In the case of healing, that means the existence of the problem and its being resolved both have to be attested by multiple witnesses.

    No one has to believe it happened, or that it happened in the way you say it did. Nor have you said anything to prove it was God and not a lying deceit of the devil to lead you into a false faith. Satan certainly can use lying wonders to lead people astray. You’ve given us no reason to know that isn’t what happened.

    I don’t say this to be insulting. It is simply that God gave us a requirement that we should take seriously. He did so to protect all of us from deceivers.

    Anyone who asks a Christian to believe claims without providing the witnesses God requires asks us to disobey God by believing without Biblical testing. So the person making the claim is not Spirit-led. It does not necessarily mean they are lying, or deceived, but that they are not Spirit-led in making the claim. God does not want us to say things to other believers that He doesn’t want them to believe.

  33. It is unfortunate you will not watch Justin Peters video, a man who cannot walk and fell into the lie of ‘healing’, but God opened his eyes. Again, God can heal if it be His will; no man since the Apostles has proven they have the power to heal.

    As for the ‘Roman road’ Gospel, the one that states you simply must believe in your heart and confess with your mouth, that isn’t how God saves sinners; it isn’t the ‘whole counsel’. A mere profession is not what saves sinners, grace does. If God has not supernaturally re-birthed a sinner, gifting them with repentance and faith to believe, they are not saved; faith is a gift from God. Bear in mind, even the demons claim to believe, and shudder. So, professing to believe in God is not what saves a sinner.
    “Ye must be born again”. The evidence of salvation lies in a forsaking of sin, and a continual changed life, a mind that is continually being renewed by the reading of the word, and a deeper understanding and desire for God and His truth. Dying to self, living for Christ, seeing that all that matters is that we seek to bring God glory in all that we say, think and do.
    Agreeing that Jesus is the Son of God does not mean we have salvation, as I’ve already pointed out, the demons know this as well, from Mark 1:24, ‘”What business do we have with each other, Jesus of Nazareth? Have You come to destroy us? I know who You are–the Holy One of God!”

    This is from John MacArthur’s sermon on healing – – – “Go back into Matthew 10:1, “Having summoned His twelve disciples, He gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out,” and that by the way is the gift of miracles. Miracle is dunamispower, power over the forces of demons, “and He gave them the power to heal every kind of disease and every kind of sickness,” and that was granted to the Twelve. Later on you find out that that group was expanded and it included the 70. Remember when He sent the 70, two by two and gave them the same power? So it was a very small group. “These were the signs,” says Paul, of a true Apostle. “Signs and wonders and miracles,” 2 Corinthians 12:12. They were limited in scope, only casting out demons and healing diseases, and they were limited in terms of who received them, only the Apostles and the 70 commissioned directly by Jesus, those who worked alongside the Apostles. It never went beyond that.

    It never became common for anybody and everybody in the church to do this. There’s no indication that the Evangelists, that the prophets, with a few exceptions, Barnabas, Philip, Stephen, those very early men, never an indication that teaching pastors could do this, and certainly no indication that members of the church, the Body of Christ, could do this. These were unique apostolic gifts. When you study the epistles of Paul, and Paul is very clear about the fact that if you have problems with Satan and demons you don’t find somebody who can chase them away, you put on your armor, right? “We have spiritual weapons to battle against those forces,” he said.

    Now if false teachers want credibility it’s very obvious that they can sure draw a crowd and gain creditability if they can heal, and so that’s always a kind of ploy that is used by false teachers. It has been so in history, whether you’re talking about tribal witch doctors in Shamanism, in Animism, and in Paganism, or whether you are talking about occultic kinds of healing, or New Age kind of mind healings, or whether you’re talking about the charlatans and the frauds who parade themselves even as Christian healers. It’s a great way to draw a crowd, why? Because the number one human anxiety is illness and death.
    I’ve seen people in the hospital on the edge of death with a gunshot wound. I’ve watched people lie comatose while machines try to keep their vital signs alive, at least on a screen, if not in reality. I watched a close friend weaken and die after an unsuccessful heart transplant. I’ve seen friends in terrible pain from surgery. I know people who are permanently disabled with sickness and injury. I see babies born with heart breaking deformities. I’ve helped people learn to cope with amputations and other tragic losses. I’ve been there when a mother was holding to her arms, in the bedroom, a dead baby who had died of crib death.

    If I could wish for anything, I could certainly wish that I could do that, heal all those people. Think how thrilling it would be. Think how rewarding it would be to have that gift. Think of what it would be like to go into a hospital among the sick and the dying, walk up and down the hall, touch people and heal them like Jesus did. Wouldn’t it be wonderful to go into the cancer ward and the heart disease ward and the Aids ward, and all the other places and just heal everybody? Somewhere along the line you want to ask these Charismatic healers why they don’t assemble all of themselves and go down to that place and let’s see if they have the power to heal. Opportunities to heal the sick are unlimited, and if, as Charismatic’s claim, such miracles are signs and wonders, listen carefully, they say this, if they are signs and wonders designed to convince unbelievers that the Gospel is true, then wouldn’t that be the way to really convince them?
    But strangely, the healers rarely, if ever, come out of their tents, rarely ever come out of their buildings; rarely ever come out of their television studios. I have never seen them in a hospital. I have never seen them walking down a ward with a camera following them. They always seem to exercise their gift in an environment which they totally control, staged their way, run according to their schedule. Why don’t we see them moving out?” – from http://www.gty.org/resources/sermons/90-60/does-god-still-heal

    You are right, we will have to disagree. There is not one solid documented case since the Apostles of a man or woman healing anybody of anything; there are countless people who claim to have the gift to heal, to perform signs and wonders, and yet, it is unfounded.
    This video from NBC Dateline exposes Benny Hinn – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVG1x-rh6FE
    This video is from an ex-faith healer who exposes the tricks used by so-called faith healers – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCohlCPSLlo

    Whenever someone claims to be healed, it’s usually from simple issues like headaches, never do you read of someone who had terminal cancer being healed. There have been numerous instances where people have put their trust in faith healers and death has resulted; these instances are documented, unlike the claims of healing so many make. Here is just one example – – –
    ‘ Rita and Douglas Swan, whose 16-month-old son Matthew died of meningitis under the care of two Christian Science practitioners in 1977, are not surprised by these statistics. Angered by their experience, she founded CHILD, Inc., to work for legal reforms that can protect children from inappropriate treatment by faith healers. She and a colleague collected and reviewed the cases of 172 children who died between 1975 and 1995 when parents withheld medical care because of reliance on religious rituals They concluded 140 of the deaths were from medical conditions for which survival rates with medical care would have exceeded 90%. These included 22 cases of pneumonia in infants under two years of age, 15 cases of meningitis, and 12 cases of insulin-dependent diabetes.
    18 more had expected survival rates greater than 50%
    All but three of the remainder would probably have had some benefit from clinical help. [17] – from http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/faith.html

    As John MacArthur stated, never do you see these ‘faith healers’ go where the terminally ill are and heal. This video exposes the t.v. faith healer/charismatic/pentecostal preachers that fleece multitudes and deceive – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn7uSmkYDJQ

  34. I said we’re gonna have to agree to disagree. People who don’t understand are resistant to change. I have witnesses. I don’t have a doctor’s note but I have people who can confirm that I was healed. They were there. You’ve obviously decided that God doesn’t heal today and that calling on the name of the Lord won’t get you saved in spite of what it says in the Word of God, so we’re just not gonna come to an agreement anywhere here. . You may be convinced I’m wrong….the difference is, I will not do anything but defend myself. You may attack my beliefs but I let them stand on their own merit. I’m fully convinced that on judgement day I will hear, “Well done, thou good and faithful servant.”

    Acts 2:21 King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)”And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”
    Joel 2:32 “And everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved; for on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will be deliverance, as the LORD has said, even among the survivors whom the LORD calls.”
    Romans 10:13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
    I think I have this right. It says here in 3 separate places that if you call on the name of the Lord you’ll be saved. Is the Bible a book of lies, or is it true????

    Oh and it’s not the person who does the healing. It’s God. The person is a vessel.
    Documentation? Here are three pages with such proof, documented and verified by physicians and photographs.

    http://www.is-there-a-god.info/life/tenhealings.shtml

    http://tinyurl.com/d2g44xo

    http://tinyurl.com/ch3q68n

  35. Let me clarify your accusation, I am not attacking your beliefs, I am stating facts. There is no solid verifiable documentation on faith healing; number two, the Bible states clearly how sinners are saved – “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.” Ephesians 2:8-9 The verses you provided do not imply that is how you ‘get saved’, by merely professing a belief in Jesus, after all, the demons believe there is a God, and tremble.
    I looked at the links you provided, and none of them give evidence to any kind of healings. They are simply stories that state ‘so and so had such and such an ailment and was healed’. This is not medically documented evidence. One would have to ask why God would heal you of a headache and let a young child die from leukemia, or a new Christian mother die from cancer. Again, we have to understand why Christ healed and why He gave His disciples the power to heal.

    As for the doctrine of soteriology, the key is one must be born again. What is your understanding of how this works?
    Salvation is a work of God the Father, Son, and Spirit. No one can come to Christ unless the Father first draws them to Him – John 6:44.
    The Spirit of God regenerates and brings to repentance the sinner {2 Timothy 2:25;Acts 11:18; John 3:3-7} Sinners are dead in sin, unable to come to Christ apart from grace. A verbal profession does not bring about salvation, only God and His grace does. Confessing Christ as Lord does not ensure one is a true believer, again let me remind you, demons confess Jesus as ‘the Holy One of Israel’ and believe in God, and shudder.

  36. Here is the main reason why God does not heal thru men like Bentley, or Benny Hinn, and anybody else for that matter, because their theology is NOT biblical.{not to mention Christ only gave the Disciples power to heal, and none since them}. Bentley coerces people to come to Christ for a better marriage, or for financial help. This is NOT the Gospel of Christ; Bentley is doing what all false teachers/healers do, appealing to the ‘flesh’ and not pricking the heart concerning sin.He then coerces sinners to ‘pray this prayer'; this is teaching a salvation by works, which Ephesians 2;8-9 clearly teaches against. He also tells those in the audience to ‘make a decision’, again, he’s adding to God’s word and claiming a work done by sinners will save. Nowhere in the Bible will you find a verse telling you to repeat a prayer, or make a decision for Christ. Here is what you will find, from Ephesians 2:4-5, “but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead through our trespasses, quickened us together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved)” It is God who quickens, God who saves, not because we repeat prayers or make decisions. Dead sinners will do no such thing because they can’t, they are dead in sin.
    Watch Bentley and his ‘gospel presentation’ at http://youtu.be/MiWzusa0x6s. As I have already stated, Bentley’s sexual sin disqualifies him from being a preacher/elder/pastor. He is in sin by claiming he has a right to preach and heal. Here is an insightful and biblical response on how to handle pastors caught in sexual sin, like Bentley – http://www.gty.org/resources/articles/A256/should-fallen-pastors-be-restored. The Lord will in no way use a man caught in sexual sin to preach from the pulpit/stage/arena, his sexual sin disqualifies him. A preacher must be ‘above reproach’ as Paul states in his epistle to Timothy; Bentley fails miserably at the standard set by God.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s